Friday, September 04, 2009

Reply to When Everything on Tithing

Rebuttal to When Everything on Tithing

Tithing - Beginning your surge of magical involvements , Sept 1, 2009

greatly edited

When: The origins of tithing can be traced to the Bible, still it is customary among many non-Christians as well as Christians to do some kind of tithing today.

Kelly: False. As you say later, tithing was used in all countries known to Abraham, including his birthplace in Babylon. They were also idolaters and sacrificed children. Being old and common does not make something moral or eternal.

When: Tithe is a traditionally a Christian term that means to contribute one tenth of your income to charity or to your Church as a form of Church giving.

Kelly: Biblical tithing was always only food from inside Israel which had been miraculously increased by God. Although money was common even in Genesis, money is not included in the 16 texts which describe the contents of the tithe. Jesus, Peter and Paul did not qualify as tithe-payers and neither did the poor nor those who lived outside Israel.

When: The word tithe derives from the Hebrew word ‘asair’, which means to donate one-tenth portion of something, mostly a person’s earnings.

Kelly: False. The word is accompanied: tithe --of food from inside Israel. Never money.

When: The Hebrew habit of tithing is recorded in the Bible, the first mention being the gift from Abraham to the Canaanite priest and king Melchizedek (Genesis 14:20).

Kelly: Nothing done by Abraham is an example which is followed by Christians today. (1) only pagan spoils of war, (2) only once, (3) not his own property, (4) he kept nothing and (5) gave the 90% to the king of Sodom.

When: Tithing was implemented by the early Christian church, and had found mention in councils at Macon in 585 and at Tours in 567. They were granted formal recognition during the time of Pope Adrian I in 787.

Kelly: The real EARLY church for almost 300 years after Calvary did not teach tithing. The attempts by Chrysostum and Augustine were not accepted. The 585 council was local; it was not accepted; it did not become law until 200 years later as Roman Catholic law.

When: In fact, it was obligatory only on those Jews who were living in the Promised Land to pay the tithe according to the Old Testament, as it was in reality a form of income tax required to support not just the government of the Israel of the Old Testament, but also its religious institutions and priests.

Kelly: Very good.

When: Present day Tithing. Despite the fact that it has originated in the Bible and earliest Christianity, now it is a unique way to gift something whenever you are given something.

Kelly: ??? You contradict yourself.

When: In spirit though, if the giving is not done out of free will and with a happy intention, it does not accomplish its proper benefit - if in fact you want to create a proper benefit by the gift.

Kelly: Good.

When: ... In spite of the disputes, tithing is still a fully and marvelously powerful act that any person can do to turn around their lives to face a fuller pathway.

Kelly: Wrong. Freewill giving -- possibly. Calling such freewill giving "tithing" -- no. Your statement is totally unjustified.

When: For those who are desirous of understanding the Christian perspective of tithing there is unlimited material available to read.

Kelly: Hardly any by legitimate upper seminary level authors. And you have already correctly disproven most of their arguments. Tithes were always only food from inside Israel.

When: To look at the real ‘why’ of how regular giving creates more we have to move into the world of Quantum Physics and Quantum Mechanics.

Kelly: This is insane. Throw the Bible out. Call freewill giving "tithing" and apply it to sinners and saints the same. Insane.

Russell Earl Kelly, PHD

No comments: