Amazing Facts: We don't
generally find it fruitful to get into contentious debate or arguments over
what we believe and teach. Our main
emphasis is to present the good news and the principles of truth with boldness,
and let individuals choose to accept or reject what they hear.
Russell Kelly: One-way communications
are not conversations at all. They are bully pulpits. If you really wanted the
“truth” heard, you would eagerly engage in public dialog for all to hear both
sides.
Batchelor: Interestingly,
Dale Ratzlaff makes the point that “As long as Adventism teaches that the
Sabbath is a salvation issue there will be a great similarity between those who
were preaching ‘another gospel’ Galatia and Adventism.”
Kelly: Try as you may,
you cannot deny what Ellen G White very clearly states in The Great Controversy that those who are not keeping the Sabbath
when Jesus returns will not be saved. I call that a salvation issue.
Batchelor: His article is
built upon a myth that is not true.
Seventh-day Adventists do not believe that we are saved by
Sabbath-keeping any more or less than other Christians believe that they are
saved by keeping the other nine commandments.
Kelly: You teach that
only Sabbath-keepers will be saved when Jesus returns. Have you not read The Great Controversy’s final chapters? You
teach that only Sabbath-keepers receive the seal of God. You teach that
non-Sabbath-keepers will receive the mark of the beast. That means you lie.
Batchelor: There are very
few Baptists, Presbyterians, charismatics, or Lutherans who believe that after
conversion we can continue knowingly to steal, commit adultery, or kill and
still be saved.
Kelly: You are loose with
the facts. Presbyterians believe in predestination which means God forces them
to obey because they have no free will. Isn’t it strange that the Holy Spirit
does not force them to keep the Sabbath? Baptists teach that believers cannot fall
from grace because they have already been adopted, already sit with Christ in
heavenly places and have already received the verdict of the final judgment.
Sins committed after justification by faith are punished and cause a loss of
fellowship, not relationship. Adventists, like Methodists and most charismatics
teach that one can fall from grace.
Batchelor: Adventists
simply believe in consistency, that the 4th commandment, beginning with the
word “remember” should get the same respect and attention as the other nine.
The inconsistency is really with the other Christians.
Kelly: No. You totally
refuse to believe Exodus 31:13-17 where God commanded Old Covenant Israel to
keep the Sabbath as a “sign” of His covenant with Him. God never commanded
Gentiles or the Church to observe the Sabbath. The Sabbath cannot at the
same time be a unique sign only for Israel and also be expected from everybody
else. God killed Hebrews for breaking the Sabbath; He never killed Gentiles
for doing the same thing. Do you want society to kill non-Sabbath-keepers? Do
you want to kill fellow Adventists who break the Sabbath? Hypocrite.
Batchelor: Does keeping
the Sabbath make us legalists?
Kelly: It does if you
teach that it is necessary in order to be saved.
Batchelor: On the
contrary, from my perspective, the Sabbath is a day of rest from our own works,
a weekly reminder that we are to worship and honor the One Who created us. We
rest not only from physical labor, but also recognize that on a spiritual
level, our salvation is based on God’s grace and not our own works.
Kelly: The Sabbath
commandment commands Hebrews to rest. IT ALSO COMMANDS THEM NOT TO CAUSE
OTHERWS TO WORK. YOU BREAK THIS PART OF IT EVERY SABBATH. In their zeal
Adventists work more on the Sabbath and thus break it more than on other days
of the week. When you drive long distances, use water, electricity, natural gas
and sewage systems they cause others to work in direct violation of the Sabbath
commandment. By traveling you cause policemen and safety officials to work; you
cause maintenance personnel to work to control traffic lights. You ignore the explicit
specific wording of the Sabbath commandment.
Batchelor: We believe
that God was not arbitrary in giving us His commandments. As our Creator, He knows what is best for us,
and He expresses His will for us through His commands.
Kelly: Adventists greatly
ignore the fact that God gave Israel much more than the Ten Commandments; He
gave those over 600 commands from Genesis to Malachi. Neither Jesus nor Paul
limited the word “law” to the Ten Commandments and it is wrong to do so. Yet
Adventists ignore the great majority of God’s Law for Israel and refer to
themselves as Sabbath-keepers and Law-keepers in direct violation of Galatians
3:10.
Batchelor: Although the
ceremonial laws were fulfilled at the Cross, and no longer need to be kept, the
Ten Commandments are an expression of God’s character and will always stand.
They explain the details of what “walking in love” means.
Kelly: Hebrews (Jews) did
not sub-divide God’s Law like that. It was either all or none per Galatians
3:10 and Deuteronomy 27:26. Scores of times God’s Word repeats that the
Commandments, Judgments and Ordinances were an in-divisible package – all or
none. Jesus explained Matthew 5:17-18 in 5:19-48 by quoting from all three
parts of the indivisible Law: Commandments, Judgments and Ordinances.
Batchelor: Romans 6:14
says that we are not under the law, but under grace. The next verse clarifies that statement,
saying: “What then? Shall we sin,
because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.” Being under grace means merely
that we are no longer under the condemnation of the law, because Jesus paid the
penalty for us.
Kelly: Notice what you
are doing now? You are now using the word “law” to ONLY mean “Ten Commandments”
because you just said “the ceremonial laws were fulfilled at the cross.” Yet
“law” to a Hebrew meant the whole revealed will of God from Genesis to Malachi.
Are Adventist still “under the condemnation” of the judgments? Why don’t you
kill your own Sabbath-breakers as the non-ceremonial law required?
Batchelor: The biggest
difference between the old and new covenants is that when one is “born again”
and becomes a “new creature”, the law is now written on the heart.
Kelly: I am still
confused. Are you using the word “law” to ONLY mean “Ten Commandments” or
something else? Romans 7:4 says that one who is in Christ is DEAD to the Law
–the whole Law – good and bad –Ten Commandments and everything else in it.
Romans 8:1-3 teaches that we are now under the new “law of the spirit of life
in Jesus Christ.” Only that part of the Old Covenant which has been repeated
after Calvary by the Holy Spirit in terms of grace and faith applies to the
Church. And the Sabbath was the only one
of the Ten Commandments which was never commanded to the Church.
Batchelor: Paul quotes
the Prophet Jeremiah when he describes the new covenant, “For this is the
covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the
Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I
will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people.” Hebrews 8:10. [quoting
Jer 31:33]
Kelly: I urge the sincere
Bible student to stop right here and read all of both Jeremiah 31:31-36 and
Hebrews 8:8-13. (1) Both the Old and New Covenant are addressed to the two houses
of Israel. (Jer 31:32; Heb 8:8) (2) Whereas the Old Covenant never applied to
any non-Hebrew, (3) the “new” is “not according” to the “old” in every aspect
(Jer 31:32; Heb 8:9). (4) The “new” covenant will include Gentiles (Mt 28:19-20;
Rom 1:16). (5) The “new” will be imbedded in the heart of every believer (Jer 31:33-34;
Heb 8:10-11). Thus, unlike tablets of stone and books of the law, truth will be
in the heart through nature, conscience and the Holy Spirit (Rom 2:14-16;
8:1-3). (4) Again, only the Sabbath is not written in the heart and conscience
by nature and the Holy Spirit. (5) Also, while it is clear that Jeremiah 31
refers to the entire Law, Adventists entangle themselves by attempting to limit
“law” to the Ten Commandments. Also, Adventists completely ignore Jeremiah
31:37-38 which speaks of national Israel -- not the Church, and not SDAs.
Batchelor: When this
happens, keeping the law springs from the heart and becomes a delight.
Kelly: Keeping what part of
the law? – only the Ten Commandments? The whole law? Only the commandments and
judgments? Or the revealed will of God after Calvary? SDAs dig a hole by
refusing to consistently define “law.”
Batchelor: I believe some
of the confusion in the minds of some people like Dale Ratzlaff originates with
a faulty view of salvation where justification and sanctification are not seen
as a part of the whole picture of grace.
Kelly: I urge the sincere
Bible student to read several articles by Dale Ratzlaff. He has a very clear
concept of salvation.
Batchelor: We usually use
the terms justification and sanctification in defining two important aspects of
the Gospel of Christ, imputed and imparted righteousness.
Kelly: Wrong.
Justification refers to imputed righteousness and is the result of accepting
the gospel of Jesus Christ in His humanity and deity. Sanctification follows
justification as the fruit of the gospel; it is not part of the righteousness
of Christ except as a fruit.
Batchelor: The word “impute”
basically means to give credit where credit is not due. When we repent and ask forgiveness of our
sins, Christ's righteousness is placed on our account, though we are totally
undeserving. It is the righteousness of Christ that makes the penitent sinner
acceptable to God and works his justification. However sinful has been his
life, if he believes in Jesus as his personal Savior, he stands before God in
the spotless robes of Christ's imputed righteousness. {Ellen G. White, Faith and Works, p. 106.}
Kelly: Such an important
statement as this requires an EGW verification rather than a biblical one. Wow!
Bathelor’s final stateaments also come from EGW – in practice, their final word
of truth.
The remainder of
Batchelor’s remarks have no relevance to why Sabbath-keeping is important for
salvation. They are more EGW material and are questionable.
……………………………
…………………………..
Batchelor: [[I believe
that the good news of the gospel offers far more than just forgiveness from
sin, and our sinful account being covered by Christ's blood. It also includes the power to have victory
over the sin that makes our lives so miserable.
Is it really good news to the drunkard in the street if we tell him,
"Christ forgives your sin", but then add, "Oh sorry, there isn't
any hope for your alcoholism, you'll always be a drunkard"? We do not teach that a person must become
perfect in order to be saved, but we do teach that Christ offers us the
wonderful gift of strength to overcome in addition to the grace that assures us
of sins forgiven. Sanctification takes place when the grace of Christ is
actually imparted to us to draw us to Christ and transform our lives. Without
the grace of Christ, the sinner is in a hopeless condition; nothing can be done
for him; but through divine grace, supernatural power is imparted to the man
and works in mind and heart and character. It is through the impartation of the
grace of Christ that sin is discerned in its hateful nature and finally driven
from the soul temple. {Ibid, p. 100}
We have a tendency to
look at things in a linear way and sometimes this causes confusion. People speak of justification happening
first, and then sanctification following.
In reality the process of
sanctification is beginning at the moment that a sinner begins to recognize the
sinfulness of his sin. It is Christ's
imparted grace that is at work on his mind and heart to bring him to the point
where he desires to repent and receive the imputed righteousness of
Christ. Then that imparted grace
continues to work to help the believer to overcome sinful habits and have the victory
over temptation. Every moment of every
day we are in need of both the imputed and imparted grace of Christ!
We have nothing to
recommend us to God; but the plea that we may urge now and ever is our utterly
helpless condition that makes His redeeming power a necessity. Renouncing all
self-dependence, we may look to the cross of Calvary and say,-- "In my
hand no price I bring; Simply to Thy cross I cling." {Desire of Ages, p. 317.}
May the Lord bless you,
James, as you seek to share His love and truth!
Warm Christian regards,
Doug Batchelor
President/Speaker
DB/ch
………………………….
…………………………
Russell Earl
Kelly, PHD
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