REPLY TO DEAN
GREIMANN ON TITHING
BY RUSSELL EARL
KELLY, PHD
On December 17, 2016,
Senior Pastor Dean Greimann, Regional Worship Center, Sherburn, MN, replied to Russell
Kelly and James Sundquist concerning tithing. This is (hopefully) the first of
a long open dialog on the subject to be posted on my blog. Since both sides of
this controversy need to be heard, we encourage brother Greimann to stay with
this discussion for the public benefit of the body of Christ. Greimann’s
telephone is 641-812-0759; his email is pastorsagrwc@frontier.com. My email is russkellyphd@yahoo.com; my BlogSpot is
russkellyphd.blogspot.com; 706-401-1276. Sunquist’s email is rrin Jay sundquistjames7@gmail.com.
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DG: Dear James
Sundquist: In response to your charges against Rev. Hickle, I would like to go
on record as stating:
1. Tithe to store up
treasures in Heaven instead of hoarding things on Earth. (Matthew 6:19-21)
RK: If the word, “tithe,” were replaced with the word, “give,” we would
have no disagreement here. We are not opposed to freewill sacrificial giving,
but we are opposed to post-Calvary unbiblical descriptions of tithing.
Although money was very common even in Genesis, the HOLY tithes (as the
word is used by Moses, Nehemiah, Malachi and Jesus) never changed from “HOLY
food from inside God’s HOLY land miraculously increased by God.” There are 16
texts validating this and none changing the description to “increase of money
from all believers in every nation.”
DG: 2. Tithe to trust God with your money. (Malachi 3:9-11) You are under a
curse—your whole nation—because you are robbing me. Bring the whole tithe into
the storehouse, that there may be food in my house. Test me in this,” says the
Lord Almighty, “and see if I will not throw open the floodgates of heaven and
pour out so much blessing that there will not be room enough to store it….”
RK: The modern
tithe-teacher uses Malachi to steal from God’s children. Notice the
discrepancies:
A. HOLY tithes were
never money
B. Gentles never were
under the command to tithe in the Old Covenant. (1:1; 4:4)
C. Tithes could not
come from outside HOLY Israel. (Lev 27:30-34)
D. Only food
producers living HOLY Israel qualified as tithe-payers. Those in other
occupations did not qualify. Jesus and Paul did not qualify as tithe-payers.
E. The curse of the
Old Covenant ended at Calvary (Gal 3:13). God does not curse born-again
believers.
F. From 1:6; 2:1;
2:17; 3:1-4 it is clear that “you” in Malachi refers to dishonest priests from
1:6-14. They had stolen the tithes in Nehemiah 13:5-10. The “whole nation of
you” – of you priests had been stealing tithes belonging to the Levites.
G. Since the whole
tithe of Judea would never fit into the Jerusalem temple storerooms, this text
only makes sense if God is telling the priests to return what they stole from
the Levites in Neh 13:5-10. Most of the tithe was brought to the cities where
Levites and priests lived per Nehemiah 10:37-38.
H. The Church
building is never called a storehouse. In fact, church buildings were illegal
in the Roman Empire until after A.D. 300. Since there were no church buildings
to store tithes in the first centuries, the application of “storehouse” to
“church buildings” is wrong.
I. The tithe is still
(correctly) called “food” in Malachi 3:10. That definition was given 1000 years
earlier in Leviticus 27:30-34; it stayed the same for Malachi; it stayed the
same 400 years later for Jesus in Matthew 23:23.
J. According to
Deuteronomy 28 to 30, the whole law was a test: obey all to be blessed; break
one to be cursed. God did not bless tithers who broke the law in other areas
(Gal 3:10).
K. “Windows,”
floodgates, insects and harvest in Malachi 3:10-12 correctly describe the
tithes as food and not money.
DG: 3. Tithe in
thankfulness to God because it is God that provides for us and He is the one
that gives us the ability to make money.
RK: There are no
validating texts because none exist. Food producers inside HOLY Israel were
thankful but they were the only Israelites commanded to tithe from that which God
miraculously increased. While God owns all (Ps 24:1), the HOLY tithe could only
from inside HOLY Israel.
DG: (Deuteronomy
8:18) You must remember the LORD your God, for he is the one who gives ability
to get wealth; if you do this he will confirm his covenant that he made by oath
to your ancestors, even as he has to this day.
RK: Again, this is
Old Covenant context only for Old Covenant Israel. God never commanded Gentiles
or the Church to tithe.
DG: (Deuteronomy
26:10) And now, O LORD, I have brought you the first portion of the harvest you
have given me from the ground.’ Then place the produce before the LORD your
God, and bow to the ground in worship before him.
RK: This is text
manipulation. Read 26:1-10.
A. It is about the
firstfruits of the new land and not tithes.
B. Firstfruits were
never the same as tithes.
C. Firstfruits would
fit into a small basket.
D. Even firstfruits
could only come from inside the HOLY land of Israel.
DG: (Matthew 22:21)
They say unto him, Caesar’s. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto
Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s.
RK: Yes, Old Covenant
food producers living inside HOLY Israel should tithe before Calvary. Now read
the context. Man’s money with the image of man was not to be given to God or to
be brought into the temple. This destroys the argument for modern money-tithing
with its unholy images.
DG: 4. To put
God first by acknowledging that the tithe belongs to Him.
(Deuteronomy 14:23)
Bring this tithe to the designated place of worship–the place the LORD your God
chooses for his name to be honored–and eat it there in his presence. This
applies to your tithes of grain, new wine, olive oil, and the firstborn males
of your flocks and herds. Doing this will teach you always to fear the LORD
your God.
RK:
A. Tithes are never
the same as firstfruits in God’s Word. Even Deut 14:23 distinguishes between
tithes and firstborn.
B. This is about the
2nd Festival-Feast tithe which was brought to the STREETS of
Jerusalem during the 3 annual feats.
C. This tithe was
EATEN in the streets by all in attendance – including the Gentile strangers.
D. Churches which do
not eat this festival tithe in the streets of Jerusalem should not use this
text to prove that everybody should tithe.
5. To honor the Lord.
(Proverbs 3:9) Honor
the LORD with your wealth and with the best part of everything you produce.
RK: Again, tithes are
never the same thing as firstfruits in God’s Word. Manipulating Proverbs 3:9-10
is a sin which takes essential money away from the needy to fill the pockets of
the clergy contrary to Paul’s admonition in First Timothy 5:8.
DG: (1 Corinthians
10:31) So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory
of God.
RK: No tithing
context.
DG: 6. Tithe to
discipline yourself. To keep yourself from saying that all of your income
belongs to you without giving God what rightly belong to Him...
RK: No tithing context.
DG: (1 Timothy 4:7) But
have nothing to do with worldly fables fit only for old women. On the other
hand, discipline yourself for the purpose of godliness.
RK: Modern “tithing”
is a “worldly fable.” Nothing, absolutely nothing taught in the Church today
about tithing is in the correct biblical context. The Church has (1) changed
the description from food to money, (2) changed the location from God’s HOLY
land to the entire earth, (3) changed the purpose from feeding Levites and
priests who forfeited land inheritance in Israel to gospel workers who own
fancy homes, (4) changed the command in Numbers 18:20 not to amass wealth to
using tithing to amass great wealth, (5) changed the limited O.T. covenant and
un-supported New Covenant context, (6) changed the description to include the
first income from S.S. checks and welfare checks where there is no increase,
(7) changed tithers from food producers inside Israel to all believers, (8)
added Gentiles to required tithers when God’s Word did not allow such and (9)
defined Jesus and Paul as tithe-payers when they are disqualified in God’s
Word.
DG: 7. Tithing
gives you joy.
(2 Corinthians 9:7)
Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not
grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
RK: No. 2 Cor 9:7 is
a description of freewill sacrificial joyful giving; it is not a description of
commanded necessary O. T. tithing only from Israel. O.T. tithes were to be
given whether grudgingly or not.
DG: (Psalm 4:7) You
have given me greater joy than those who have abundant harvests of grain and
new wine.
RK: No context of
tithing. In fact, the word “tithe, tithes, tithing” does not occur in any Psalm
or any writing of David or Solomon.
DG: 8. A biblical church helps people in need. Tithe to help church ministries to grow so that the church can reach
out physically and spiritually to others. Tithing so that the kingdom of Heaven
can and will advance through our communities.
RK: Again this has no tithing context.
DG: (Hebrews 13:16) And
do not neglect doing good and sharing, for with such sacrifices God is pleased.
RK: This is not in
the context of tithing. The church which falsely teaches that tithes are
firstfruits steals from God’s poorest children contrary to First Timothy 5:8.
DG: (2 Corinthians
9:6) But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and
he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.
RK: This is not in
the context of tithing. Those who have nothing to sow should not be made to
feel guilty.
DG: (Proverbs
19:17) The one who is gracious to the poor lends to the LORD, and the
LORD will repay him for his good deed.
RK: A Christian’s
first priority is to make sure his own family has minimum shelter, food, heat
and medicine. The church which demands a tithe first is stealing from God’s
poorest.
1 Tim 5:8 But if any
provide not for his own, and especially for those of his own house, he hath
denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.
DG: (1 Corinthians
9:13-14) Don’t you know that those who serve in the temple get their food from
the temple, and that those who serve at the altar share in what is offered on
the altar? In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the
gospel should receive their living from the gospel.
RK:
A. If verse 14 only refers to verse 13, then
Christians must duplicate every single type of support O.T. Levites and priests
received in the Temple –thus the argument is self-defeating.
B. If “in the same
way” from verse 14 refers back to verses 7-13, then it concluding a principles
that all vocations care for their own from their own principles. The principles
of support for gospel workers in verse 14 are the gospel principles of grace
and faith and not the law.
DG: (Numbers 18:21) I
give to the Levites all the tithes in Israel as their inheritance in return for
the work they do while serving at the tent of meeting.
RK: This verse
contradicts modern tithe-teaching because it proves that the full Levitical
tithe went ONLY to the SERVANTS of the priests. The priests only received 1% as
seen in Numbers 18:25-28. If this verse were obeyed, tithes would go to the
deacons, greeters, musicians, singers and church workers.
DG: (Romans 10:14)
How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they
believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without
someone preaching to them?
RK: Paul boasted
about preaching for free 1 First Corinthians 9 and Acts 20. O.T. priests and
Levites only worked one week out of 24 in the Temple; the remainder of the time
they were herdsmen, farmers and tradesmen per First Chronicles, chapters 23 to
26. You have no biblical authority to demand tithes be paid to support
full-time gospel workers. The Bible neither commands nor prohibits full-time
gospel workers.
DG: 9. God will
bless you for placing Him first in your giving to Him your tithes.
RK: Again you infer a
claim without validating texts. Placing God’s kingdom first (Matthew 6:33) does
not invalidate First Timothy 5:8. Neither does it teach tithing after Calvary.
Again, Scripture must be twisted out of context in order to equate tithing with
firstfruits.
DG: … just take a closer look at His churches in
third world countries. He blesses those who freely give out of their love and
obedience to His commands, expecting nothing in return.
RK: The key word is
“freely” – not grudgingly, not by command and not by radically changing the
biblical definition of the HOLY tithe. If tithing worked, every Christian would
tithe and there would be no poor Christians. The fact is that most that sacrificially
“tithe” remain very poor.
DG: … One can never
out-give God.
RK: That is true, but
it does not validate post-Calvary tithing. As a carpenter, Jesus Himself did
not qualify as a tithe-payer.
DG: … referring to
money that belongs to the Lord …
RK: Please give
validating Scripture before making these kinds of remarks. Jesus said to give
money with images of Caesar on it to Caesar; that includes our money today.
Howe do you explain that?
DG: I’ve witnessed ….
people who cheerfully gave were blessed in their finances.
RK: Yes, we have all
witnessed that but it does not validate tithing because the vast majority of
“tithe-payers” in poverty remain in poverty; it is not a magic formula. We have
also witnessed atheists, agnostics and Muslims who become very wealthy by
applying sound business practices.
DG: 10a.
Tithing shows your love for the Lord …
RK: Where does God’s Word say that? Stop inventing your own morality
statements. Food tithes were required for Hebrews living inside God’s HOLY land
whether they loved God or not.
DG: 10b. … and it tests where your heart is at.
RK: God never commanded Gentiles to tithe. Tithing was only a pre-Calvary
test for food-producers living inside HOLY Israel. And, the whole law was a
test in Deuteronomy 28 to 30: obey all to live; break one to die (Galatians
3:10). Please explain that.
DG: 10c. … Tithing your first fruits is one thing that God commands
us to do
RK: You keep repeating this same lie. Tell me where tithes and
firstfruits are the same thing! The tithe was the TENTH animal and the TENTH of
the crop which could only be counted after the full harvest. And tell me where
God “commands” “us,” His Church, to tithe. You keep repeating the same weak
arguments over and over.
DG: (2 Corinthians 8:8-9)
RK: This is a
reference to freewill sacrificial generous joyful giving ---not tithing which was
none of those.
DG: (John 14:15)
"If you love Me, keep My commandments.
RK: What does this
mean in context? Jesus lived and died while the Old Covenant was in full
authority. Jesus taught and perfectly kept all of the Law without sin. Before
Calvary Jesus’ “commandments” included temple sacrifices, temple worship and
tithing to support Levites and priests. Are we to tithe to Levites and priests
as Jesus commanded?
DG: In conclusion,
your approach to God’s command for us to give Him the sacrifice of our first
fruits, including our income, is a worldview that is invading the post-modern
church and is spreading across our nation today.
RK: Read back over
our article and count how many times you have stated WITHOUT VALIDATING TEXTS
that “tithes ae the same thing as firstfruits.” You, my friend, are a LIAR and
are twisting God’s Word!!! My view of tithing is from God’s Word in its
original context. On the other hand, your view is that of the modern church
which has totally destroyed the context and original meaning of God’s “tithe”
and has redefined it as “income from all sources.”
1. What gives you the right to re-define the
Old Covenant HOLY tithe as “income” instead of “food from inside God’s HOLY
land miraculously increased by Him”?
2. What gives you the
right to teach what you glean about tithing and leave out Numbers 18:20-28
which limits property ownership, amassing wealth and giving the tithe to
servants instead of ministering priests?
3. What gives you the
right to receive tithes from Social Security and welfare which are not
“increase” and force God’s poorest to go without proper medicine, shelter and
food?
4. I will reply to
your closing article on the Law and Covenants soon.
In Christ’s love
Russell Earl Kelly
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